tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11840313.post114601409250137292..comments2024-03-10T10:54:59.776-07:00Comments on Ben Witherington: What are we Doing Here? Christians in a Stange LandBen Witheringtonhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/06017701050859255865noreply@blogger.comBlogger10125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11840313.post-1146526688662415262006-05-01T16:38:00.000-07:002006-05-01T16:38:00.000-07:00I agree about the problem of Christian secularism....I agree about the problem of Christian secularism. An example is going to war. If we are to harmless as doves, and soldiers were told by John to harm no man, then how can Christian secularists defend war and preemptive strike? Yet soon there will be a holy war between Christian Secularists and Muslims and Jews associated with strife over the land of Canaan.<BR/>Are you interested in topics about the apocalypse, end times, the end of the world, eschatology, last days, the horsemen of the apocalypse, the beast, prophesy, prophesies, revelation, 666, bible prophesy, prophets, Canaan, Canaan's land, Land of Canaan, or the Christian future? If so you may enjoy reading " Land of Canaan." This is a free online book. The Link is http://landofcanaan.info/book.php<BR/>Let me know what you think.<BR/><BR/>Thanks,<BR/><BR/>Paul M. Kingery, PhDPaul M. Kingeryhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05554717578086834370noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11840313.post-1146244788092488352006-04-28T10:19:00.000-07:002006-04-28T10:19:00.000-07:00As an ATS alumnus, it has been a great blessing fo...As an ATS alumnus, it has been a great blessing for me to read this sermon by the incredible Dr. Bauer.<BR/><BR/>With that being said, I get the impression that the discussion here would lead others to believe that the church of North America is a dismal failure. Is true Christianity on such a decline as to declare an identity crisis? Can our "Post-Christian" culture be legitimately compared to the "pre-Christian" culture of the NT and beyond? What is meant by statements like "prevailing Christian culture has led us to a very non-christian place." <BR/><BR/>Culture is constantly shifting around us, however, I am not so certain that we have to suggest "identity crisis" every time this happens. Rather than pointing to the areas/organizations that have failed to be a true representation of Christian discipleship, why not point to the ones that are leading the way. <BR/><BR/>Can someone define "Post-Christian" and the implications of such a reality. If "Post-Christian" is to mean less (in numbers) Christians, I would question what you are dreaming about. If however, you simply mean Christians taking their faith more seriously and following passionately after Christ...so be it.Bensonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16232062015903494728noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11840313.post-1146232475386102532006-04-28T06:54:00.000-07:002006-04-28T06:54:00.000-07:00Hi Elizabeth:Thanks for this good word. You are of...Hi Elizabeth:<BR/><BR/>Thanks for this good word. You are of course right. Of the three classic models: 1) Christ against culture; 2) Christ along side culture; 3) Christ transforms culture, I agree that the third is what the NT talks about. However that transformation interestingly enough largely takes place 'in house' by which I mean it happens by embracing outsiders and bringing them into the community of faith where they experience a transformative community, hopefully. But as the culture becomes increasingly alien to Christianity, there is of course a 'Christ against culture' dimension to things that is unavoidable. It is telling to me however, that the major model conservative Christians have practiced is withdrawal from culture, especially when it comes to public schooling. This of course is a sure way to make certain the public school system goes from bad to worse. If you take the leaven out of the lump it will never rise again.<BR/><BR/>Blessings,<BR/><BR/>Ben W.Ben Witheringtonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06017701050859255865noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11840313.post-1146201187743244652006-04-27T22:13:00.000-07:002006-04-27T22:13:00.000-07:00Our media and our society have become so fragmente...Our media and our society have become so fragmented that we have few shared experiences anymore. Dr. Bauer's sermon tells us that this is ok, and yet not ok. It is not our place to separate ourselves from the world, but it is our duty as Christians to embrace it. Our discipleship should have a greater impact than merely the sound made by thumping a Bible, and yet if we are not part of the world, what other sound do we make? <BR/><BR/>This sermon is painfully beautiful. Thank you to both you and Dr. Bauer for sharing it.Elizabeth Kreckerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12122785972211597168noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11840313.post-1146158455628781462006-04-27T10:20:00.000-07:002006-04-27T10:20:00.000-07:00This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.Terry Hamblinhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06346629921055055879noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11840313.post-1146084376303792802006-04-26T13:46:00.000-07:002006-04-26T13:46:00.000-07:00Thank you sharing Dr. Bauer’s sermon. His descrip...Thank you sharing Dr. Bauer’s sermon. His descriptions were right on point—calling this a “post-Christian society” which is not only secular, but downright pagan. As with Paul at the Areopagus, we too can say that modern-day Americans are “very religious.” They’re grasping for anything spiritual and finding no shortage of imitations to choose from. <BR/><BR/>What stark contrast from today’s society—the call to be holy, humble, and full of hope. Now more than ever, we need to live out our faith in a way that is real and meaningful. But most Christians are shallow in their relationship with God and their understanding of His word that they have very little to offer those on the outside. This needs to change—and likely will with greater persecution. We need to be deliberate about cultivating a deeper relationship with God. And we need to be more open to doing whatever God requires of us. This is a critical time for Christians, yet I think we all sense that God is orchestrating the circumstances to bring about His purpose—to save as many souls as possible while there is still time.Chong Choehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12383431265749086087noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11840313.post-1146079524600698682006-04-26T12:25:00.000-07:002006-04-26T12:25:00.000-07:00You are so right Mark, thanks for sharing...... We...You are so right Mark, thanks for sharing...... We have traded our birth right for a mess of American pottage or porridge.<BR/><BR/>Blessings,<BR/><BR/>BenBen Witheringtonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06017701050859255865noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11840313.post-1146078589512190492006-04-26T12:09:00.000-07:002006-04-26T12:09:00.000-07:00Thanks for “reprinting” this. I find myself like y...Thanks for “reprinting” this. I find myself like you resonating with much of it. <BR/><BR/>I tend to lean towards the feeling that Christendom’s fading light is a good thing, for many of the reasons David points to in his sermon. I think the prevailing Christian culture has lead us to a very non-christian place, and in finding ourselves in this place we have to honestly rediscover what a life in Christ means. I think that's a good thing.<BR/><BR/>I think more of our Christian culture, or world view, or Meta-narrative, or (Insert your favorite phrase here), is rooted much more in the social structures of modernity, rather than the revolutionary grace of God through Jesus Christ. Maybe landing in the “strange land” will help us rediscover the incarnate God?.... Your milage may vary<BR/><BR/>MarkRevrdMarkhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07351246724376936431noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11840313.post-1146047857782570932006-04-26T03:37:00.000-07:002006-04-26T03:37:00.000-07:00For those who'd like to hear the sermon, it's avai...For those who'd like to hear the sermon, it's available at http://exam.asburyseminary.edu/-mp3/chapels/04252006-hi.mp3David Mackinderhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01418303910448201961noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11840313.post-1146043076932567142006-04-26T02:17:00.000-07:002006-04-26T02:17:00.000-07:00Really helpful. Thanks for posting that.“Why shoul...Really helpful. Thanks for posting that.<BR/><BR/><EM>“Why should I let him determine how I will act?”</EM><BR/><BR/>Excellent!graham oldhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02516464862589120674noreply@blogger.com