tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11840313.post112213855508759947..comments2024-03-10T10:54:59.776-07:00Comments on Ben Witherington: The Validity of Religious ExperienceBen Witheringtonhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/06017701050859255865noreply@blogger.comBlogger3125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11840313.post-1122276948150001642005-07-25T00:35:00.000-07:002005-07-25T00:35:00.000-07:00Your essay spoke in general, but what part of God'...Your essay spoke in general, but what part of God's Word and what part of Christ's behavior ought to be emphasized?<BR/><BR/>Jesus (or perhaps later Gospel authors speaking for Jesus) cursed "the Pharisees," calling them names as bad as any in that day. Did Jesus overturn tables, causing a tumult in the Temple, even using a knotted cord on animals and/or people? Paul was not without a certain skill in name calling either. The Book of Revelation is filled with curses, as is the end of Deuteronomy. One might include the first curses in Genesis. How serious ought we to take the cursing aspects of the Bible and make them our own? Certainly the Bible predicts strife, family members "hating" one another, and Jesus saying he had come to cast fire on the earth and "how I wish it was already kindled." Such prophecies if they may be so called have been fulfilled many times over in the history of Christendom, for strife naturally accompanies all evangelical movements of any and all religions that preach eternal judgment based on the truths that any one of those religions preach.<BR/><BR/>Also speaking in terms of what part of God's Word and what part of Christ's behavior ought to be emphasized, consider how vast is Christianity, with over 35, some say 45 thousand different sects and denominations. Many of them believe "hell" is the destination of "other so-called Christians," instead of the doctrine of hell promoting general ethical behavior among all Christians, Muslims and Jews. Some Christians also use "the rod" on children. Some Christians still think John Calvin's list of Biblical laws, punishments and proscribed behaviors are essential, and they are working to promote such laws in government. Neither do Christians seem to be able to convince one another of the truth of each other's views on matters as diverse as same-sex unions, female equality, and a host of issues. Evangelical Christian publishers have even begun producing a “viewpoints” series. Apparently the Bible does not speak clearly on a host of important issues. <BR/><BR/>Books by InterVarsity Press: <BR/><BR/>Two Views of Hell: A Biblical and Theological Dialog <BR/><BR/>Four Views on Divine sovereignty and Human Freedom <BR/><BR/>Four Christian Views of Economics <BR/><BR/>Four Theologians Debate the Major Millennial Views <BR/><BR/>Women in Ministry: Four Views <BR/><BR/>Divorce and Remarriage: Four Christian Views <BR/><BR/>Theologians and Philosophers Examine Four Approaches to War <BR/><BR/>Books by Zondervan Press, part of their Counterpoints Series: <BR/><BR/>Two Views on Women in Ministry <BR/><BR/>Three Views on the Rapture <BR/><BR/>Three Views on the Millennium and Beyond <BR/><BR/>Three Views on Creation and Evolution <BR/><BR/>Are Miraculous Gifts for Today: Four Views <BR/><BR/>Show Them No Mercy: Four Views on God and Canaanite Genocide <BR/><BR/>Four Views on Salvation in a Pluralistic World <BR/><BR/>Four Views on the Book of Revelation <BR/><BR/>Four Views on Eternal Security <BR/><BR/>Four Views on Hell <BR/><BR/>Five Views of Law and Gospel <BR/><BR/>Five Views on Sanctification <BR/><BR/>Five Views on Apologetics <BR/><BR/>There is a range of Christian beliefs and behaviors even wider than the viewpoints series above. I have a list somewhere. But just to name one, slave owning, is it ever declared a "sin" in the Bible in either testament (Jesus himself is described as taking for granted in a parable, that the disobedient slave "shall be beaten with many stripes," a verse that was cited by some devoutly Southern Christian slaveowners--Mark Noll at Wheaton has written on this topic and mentioned the rift between Christians that the question of slavery caused, a rift that was not healed by citing Bible verses). Slave owning Christians and pro-slavery theologians knew their Bibles well indeed, as Noll points out.<BR/><BR/>Also, can the Bible alone decide whether the American Revolutionary war was truly a godly revolution, or not? The British believed in their system of government that revolved around "God and the King." It was the American forces that were tainted with Deistically inclined writers and thinkers, like Thomas Paine, whose little book fired the first volley. And Saint Paul does not seem inclined toward revolution either. <BR/><BR/>In short, what specifically can anyone say about the Bible's specific guidelines without someone else finding some other passages concerning alternate types of behavior, or even alternate spiritual practices and beliefs?<BR/><BR/>I think Christians, like people with other beliefs, take them for granted. We all do. And there is no easy way to separate and absolutely distinquish the true spirit of Christ any more than say, the true spirit of Marx. (Not that I am a Marxist, but he had a heart for the working man, who was being destroyed in the "mills of Satan" as Blake called the factories of the industrial revolution, and Marx also loved his wife, writing her and saying, "Let the Christians have their god, and Hindus have theirs, so long as I have you to love and adore." Marx also co-wrote the Communist Manifesto with Engles who owned a factory and let the workers own a portion of it. Marx however was wrong to emphasize revolution. He did not foresee the possibility of workers forming unions to demand better wages and working conditions. Marx also compared religion to the "laudanum" of his day, an opiate pain-relieving drug that the rich could afford to indulge in, but which the poor could not afford. Marx allowed that religion was the opiate of the masses who could not afford laudanum. Marx also hoped for a "worker's paradise." What then was the true spirit of Marx? He loved his wife and was as appalled at the way human beings were mistreated as Dickens and Blake were. And today, even the U.S. government practices Marxist governmental principles such as taking money from the wealthy and redistributing it to those in need. <BR/><BR/>Just a few thoughts. There are things in both Jesus and Marx that I admire. Jesus warned most loudly against two things, the corrupting influence of wealth and against religious pride and hypocrisy.<BR/><BR/>We should take all books and people and seek what's best in them, and also note when they or their followers take things to excess.<BR/><BR/>Be open to the best in every person and every book. Though we do like to try and simplify matters, as if only a single book could tell us all we need to know, and damned be all other books, or people who find our book to contain questionable elements.Edwardtbabinskihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13036816926421936940noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11840313.post-1122246270633962732005-07-24T16:04:00.000-07:002005-07-24T16:04:00.000-07:00Hi James:Thanks for this note. I experienced the s...Hi James:<BR/><BR/>Thanks for this note. I experienced the same thing in pastoring six churches in N.C. One thing that helps is upping the level of Biblical literacy and accountability in one's congregation.<BR/>Blessings,<BR/><BR/>BenBen Witheringtonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06017701050859255865noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11840313.post-1122140821501306442005-07-23T10:47:00.000-07:002005-07-23T10:47:00.000-07:00Your final two sentences are remarkably observant ...Your final two sentences are remarkably observant and I think right on the money. Thanks for sharing them.Jimhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16698562143972216357noreply@blogger.com